[Wine] Requesting unban from irc channel

Andrew Fenn andrewfenn at gmail.com
Sun Mar 22 09:56:17 CDT 2009

>> The log you have supplied does not include anywhere near the full conversation

I apologise for not including the full log as I didn't see it
necessary to my point. Please however do not assume there is some
malicious reason behind it as you suggested.

>> And before you argue that evading a +q does not warrant a ban, let me rebut: YES IT DOES.

Forgive me for not knowing the specifics of IRC or what you did in the
first place but here is what I saw before you banned him for "ban

>> man_in_shack sets ban on %tsukasa!*@*

tsukasa_ then dropped out the channel then joined back and says

>> <tsukasa_> real mature

tsukasa_ may have broken the channel rules but only after you reacted
in an inappropriate manner. If you had asked him to wait then he would
not have been banned and you or someone else in the channel would have
eventually answered his question.

Banning is not the standard way of making someone wait while you try
and understand their question to help them.

I'm happy you were able to resolve this however if his question was
answered rather then being banned for a situation you created, the
user would have left happy and satisfied rather then having to come to
the mailing list to get unbanned so he could try and get his question
answered a second time around.

Again it's great that you sorted this out, but my concern is that if
these situations continue to happen it is going to make the wine
community look bad. It was only a few weeks ago that someone else was
complaining on the mailing list that they were unfairly banned from
the channel.

Sorry if it looks like I am picking on you, my interests are in making
users see the good wine community and not be burned by bad judgements.
I'm glad you're helping out in the wine channel and I'm sure this is a
rare incident.

May I suggest in the future that if you want someone wait while you
figure out what they're doing you ask them to wait instead of
forcefully removing them from the channel. Doing such a thing means
others can not help you to answer the questions and also kills a
user's good mood. People can sometimes be difficult in describing
their problems however you must remember to try and stay positive and
work with them.

On Sun, Mar 22, 2009 at 1:49 PM, Ben Klein <shacklein at gmail.com> wrote:
> 2009/3/22 Andrew Fenn <andrewfenn at gmail.com>:
>> Why did you ban/kick him in the first place instead of explain you
>> can't help him? I don't see any reason for this behaviour as it was
>> only you guys active in the channel at the time.
>> I've attached the log to this email for people not there. Do you
>> regularly ban people whose questions you can't answer or is this a
>> special case?
> The log you have supplied does not include anywhere near the full
> conversation, not that it's really relevant any more. If I didn't know
> better, I'd say you've doctored it to make me look bad.
> After closely re-reading what he said in the channel and on
> wine-users, I know what he was doing - two X server instances, one
> with Twinview and both displays active, the other with only one
> display active - but I still don't understand why he was doing it, nor
> was it particularly clear at the time. (He seemed to be saying he was
> using an X server on display 1 and an X server on display 2 working
> both with and without Twinview at the same time.)
>>>> You were *quietted* (a +q or % ban) because you appeared to be contradicting yourself.
>> That's a poor excuse to kick someone from the channel. If you think
>> someone is wasting your time then just tell them you can't help them
>> and/or go to a different channel.
> I did NOT kick him for contradicting himself. I imposed what was
> intended to be a temporary +q while I tried to work out what he was
> doing from his contradictory information, and give him the best advice
> from that. He didn't give me the chance to do this, and instead evaded
> the +q, which warrants instant ban (though not permanent ban). He then
> got kicked by the resident bot.
> Let me put this in the simplest terms possible. He was banned for ban
> evasion, not for any disagreement we had before that. The ban is now
> lifted as it was never intended to be permanent. I have already
> apologised for the length of time it took to lift the ban, as I had to
> go out. What more could I have done?
> And before you argue that evading a +q does not warrant a ban, let me
> rebut: YES IT DOES.

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