AW: Already Error while installing MS Office 2003

[Colin Wright]

(Reformatted to bottom-posting)

Roland Kaeser wrote:

 >  >----- Ursprüngliche Mail ----
 >  >Von: Jim White <jim at pagesmiths.com>
 >  >An: Roland Kaeser <roli8200 at yahoo.de>
 >  >CC: wine-devel at winehq.com
 >  >Gesendet: Freitag, den 15. September 2006, 19:41:45 Uhr
 >  >Betreff: Re: Already Error while installing MS Office 2003
 >  >
 >  >Roland Kaeser wrote:
 >  >
 >  >> Just tried to test install office 2003 on wine 0.9.21. But getting
 >  >> already errors. I read in C't (german it magazine) that office 2003
 >  >> works on codeweavers. Can somebody declare me this? Does codeweavers
 >  >> voluntary not provide the corrections to wine to sell their product?
 >  >> Looks very strange to me.
 >  >> ...
 >  >
 >  >Codeweavers version of Wine has changes that Alexandre deems
 >  >unacceptable for the "clean" WineHQ tree.
 >  >
 >  >The Codeweavers Wine source is here:
 >  >
 >  >http://www.codeweavers.com/products/source/
 >  >
 >  >Jim
 >
> 
> Hello
> 
>  >Codeweavers version of Wine has changes that Alexandre deems
>  >unacceptable for the "clean" WineHQ tree.
> 
> If this is that way, it would be real a horror. Why are code patches 
> which allows a huge major app (key application) to run on linux 
> "unacceptable" (From point of view of the MS users). Do we here make 
> trench warfares?  Or are there quality conceivabilities which are 
> completely unrealistic? Shouldn't we not see the major goal of wine? To 
> run windows apps on linux? Not to have a few lines code a bit better 
> quality etc. I think we don't have the choice to reject code. Be very 
> very thankful for each line which is checked in!! I think some 
> responsible persons are to deep in the code.  They are looking just into 
> the code but can't see the benefit of the code for the wine project 
> itself. Why don't just accept the code? There is enough time later to 
> make it more "beautiful" or correct it to a better quality. But for the 
> moment, some of the code directly allows important apps to work.
> 
> Roland
> 

<unlurk>
This is a very old, very shrivelled chestnut.

CodeWeavers' CrossOver Office is guaranteed to run a specific,
limited list of program, including specified versions
of Microsoft Office.  It may, or may not, run other program.

Having a limited list of supported program makes it feasible
to include program-specific code and incomplete implementations of
Windows API functions that could cause errors in other programs.

WineHQ's doesn't have the "advantage" of limited focus.  WineHQ
does not include program-specific code.  Its focus is a full
and efficient implementation of the Windows API.  Programs
become supported by WineHQ as new parts of the Windows API are
implemented and the implementations completed.  Program-specific
code would cause bloat and be difficult to maintain.  Accepting
inefficient code allow inefficiencies to build up and
impact greatly on performance.

That's not to say that WineHQ development isn't driven by
the desire to support particular programs.  It is, but the
difference to CrossOver is that the code that is accepted
into WineHQ is expected to work with all Windows program.
( There is a specific issue with the window management
that can cause a problem for some 3D games, but that would
involve another highly complex rewrite to fix so I think the
previous sentence is reasonable. )  When WineHQ breaks a
program that used to work it's usually a bug in new code
that the test suite couldn't identify, not because the code
to support one program is incompatible with another.

To get the CrossOver solutions into WineHQ the program-specific
code first has to be rewritten as an efficient, generic solution.
While that may delay support of some programs in the WineHQ
releases and source the long-term benefits for WineHQ are
speed, reduced size and more supported programs.

It's quite wrong to say that WineHQ can't afford to reject code.
The reason it can and should reject code can be summed up in
two words: open source.

The open source model allows WineHQ to have very high standards
because any user that needs support for specific programs can
download the source, patch it and compile it themselves.

In fact, that's how CrossOver works.  It's a version from WineHQ
patched for the supported programs.  When CodeWeavers rewrite their
program-specific patches into a generic solution that is committed
to WineHQ they will also be able to update their tree with the generic
solution.  Program-specific patches are a maintenance overhead and the
closer they are to the WineHQ tree the better.  By keeping their tree
closer to the WineHQ tree it will also be easier to use other patches
committed to WineHQ.  I'm sure that at certain times CrossOver is updated
to a set of patches against a newer WineHQ version for those reasons.

The CrossOffice source is publicly available at the URL Jim White gave.
Patches sent for submission to WineHQ are available on the
Wine patches list (gmane.comp.emulators.wine.patches) even if
not in the WineHQ repository.

Want the CrossOver program-specific code so you can run Office 2003
but don't want to or can't afford to pay for support?
Get the source from the URL Jim gave and compile it yourself.

Want to play World of Warcraft?  Download the WineHQ source,
get the World of Warcraft patch and compile it yourself.

Need support for another game that WineHQ can't yet handle?
Try some of the latest patches.

Want to run on Solaris?  Get the Solaris patches.

The WineHQ repository provides a evolving, high-quality
foundation on which to build.  Anything that weakens
that foundation would only damage Wine in the future.

I'm not a Wine developer.  I thought I'd give a little of my time
to save them some.

Colin

</unlurk>